Bird Dogging or Flipping Properties???????????????????(LONG) - Posted by Brian W(IN)

Posted by Redline on June 10, 1999 at 08:01:25:

Who told you the RE industry is “cracking down” on people flipping RE? When you flip property you are acting as principal (for yourself) - as you already have the property under contract. Nothing to crack down on. You’re confusing “birddogging” with flipping contracts. Birddogs just go and fetch properties for investors and get some undisclosed reward. They are not acting as principal and never appear on any paperwork.

What you’re doing sure looks to me like practicing RE without a license. You’re performing RE services for others for a fee … and this will get you nailed before long. Investors don’t “charge” anyone for anything … they act on behalf of themselves and make a profit.


Bird Dogging or Flipping Properties???(LONG) - Posted by Brian W(IN)

Posted by Brian W(IN) on June 10, 1999 at 07:19:35:

I was wondering if anyone out there is getting started in RE by being a bird dog for other investors. I have several questions, the first one is - How do you categorize yourself as a “bird dog”? The reason is because I had started looking for properties to flip to other investors and I was told that the RE industry is cracking down on people who are “flipping” properties to other investors and have decided to do what is called “bird dogging”. I however, am not only getting the properties for investors, I am also getting comps, viewings, and getting all paperwork together for closing. I am doing this through a friend of mine who happens to be an RE Agent. I am charging each investor between $1000 to $2000 per deal. Is this a reasonable fee to be charging? Also, what are you charging each investor that you find properties for and what type of work are you doing for them?

All responses are appreciated

Re: Bird Dogging or Flipping Properties???(LONG) - Posted by Brian (IN)

Posted by Brian (IN) on June 16, 1999 at 21:09:16:

What area of IN are you in I would be interested in talking to you about the properties you are finding.

Brian G.

Re: Bird Dogging or Flipping Properties???(LONG) - Posted by Brian W(IN)

Posted by Brian W(IN) on June 14, 1999 at 16:40:00:

Thanks everyone for all your help. My decision is to do flips and bird dog at the same time. The reason is because I have several different investors who are looking for different types of deals and I have different RE Agents which I am using to get information from the MLS. I figure that because I have so many deals that I can get in on, I could do both, depending on the situation of each deal. Thanks again for all of your comments.

Flipping ?? - Posted by Joe(IN)

Posted by Joe(IN) on June 14, 1999 at 16:29:57:


I’ve learned that in my area the term “Flip” is often used to describe the “straw man” scam. This is where the “straw man” buys a house for a low price, sells the house to his buddy for top dollar, then splits the proceeds of the sale with himself, his buddy, and often the mortgage broker. I would guess that is the type of thing they are cracking down on. For this reason I do not use the term “flip” in my local market.

A true “flip”, which is discussed here on the board is simply when you get the contract to buy the property. and then you sell the contract or the property immediately to someone else. Totally legal and ethical. You make as much spread as you can.

It would appear that this is what you want to start doing, so you don’t look so much like an agent without a license.

Hope this helps,

Flips - Posted by Randy -IL-

Posted by Randy -IL- on June 10, 1999 at 08:57:57:

I don’t have much answer to your question, but I do have a comment for the folks who are telling you that the industry is cracking down on flipping.

The people who say flipping is wrong or unethical obviously don’t shop at supermarkets, gas stations, car lots, furniture stores, or anywhere else people sell products or services for retail prices. Or they may just be totally oblivious to the reality of economics. Eggs, cheese, sofas, cars, lumber, you name it, we’ve all been sold a flipped item.

All retail products were purchased at wholesale prices then immediately flipped to us, the retail consumers. Many times at 50-100% markups. We are all “victims” of flipping every day.

Buying and selling real estate is only buying and selling a commodity like anything else. The differences being, the numbers are much bigger and the commodity doesn’t move (in most cases). If I could make the same great returns on oranges, grapes, lumber, cars, or some other commodity I would do it. It just so happens that I’m more comfortable (and profitable) with the commodity of real estate.

Happy investing,

Re: Bird Dogging - Posted by B.L.Renfrow

Posted by B.L.Renfrow on June 10, 1999 at 08:11:04:


That’s certainly one of the methods you can use to get started, but it’s not particularly profitable. And the difference between bird-dogging and flipping is this: as a bird-dog, you locate properties, perhaps gather some basic info, then pass it along to an investor, who may pay you a couple of hundred dollars if he or she buys the property. Hardly big bucks. When flipping, on the other hand, you actually get the property under contract yourself, then assign or sell (“flip”) the contract to either an investor or, less likely, a retail buyer, for a fee in the range you mentioned, i.e. 1-2k. Of course, whether this is a reasonable fee depends upon a number of factors: purchase price, area, repairs needed, etc.
Once you’ve done a couple of these, you’ll have enough confidence to take on some more profitable deals.

“I was told that the RE industry is cracking down on people who are “flipping” properties to other investors and have decided to do what is called “bird dogging”.”

Who told you this? Sounds like the words of a non-investor. Nothing illegal about it, so long as it’s done properly. For more info, read the articles on this site about flipping, or check out Legrand’s book.

Good luck…

Brian (NY)