Business Systems anyone?... - Posted by Sheik

Posted by Jim on March 24, 1999 at 10:58:01:


Whenever a third person is involved, ie. Realtor, it is much harder to structure creative financing. Not that it cannot be done but because you have to teach or explain in detail the benefits which takes lots of time and creates undue problems.

Rule of thumb is when dealing with third parties you should try for the discount only, no terms. When dealing with the principle owner, you can try discount, terms, or both discount and terms. When dealing with third parties, the best probability is with ugly - rehab houses that you assign to investors. When dealing with the principle owner, you can buy both rehabs and pretty houses using terms and assign to owner occupants.

When we buy and sell houses on the Internet using Realtors, we buy rehabs to assign to investors. When we buy and sell houses on the Internet working with FSBO’s, we buy nice houses on terms (creatively) and sell to owner occupants.

I sincerely hope this has helped


P.S. I just noticed your e-mail to me and I apologize for the delay.

Business Systems anyone?.. - Posted by Sheik

Posted by Sheik on March 23, 1999 at 07:11:13:

Okay, I have been ‘hangin’ here for a year+. I have purchase numerous courses, read (and read some more) and absorbed everything I can. I have done a few MH deals, L/Os and a rehab. Nothing spectacular, but given where I’ve come from (can you say “Conservative”?), I think…“Not bad”.

Simply put, I could not have (would not have) done any of it without Creonline…worst yet, I wouldn’t have even realized that I should be doing something!..Thank You All!

I am now at a point where I am trying to establish a “system” (process if you will) of business. As you all know, the hardest part of this business(at least for me) is finding the deal. As a result, prospecting for the deal becomes the most important action one can take.

I work the MLS (I have unlimited access) for exp listings and REOs and I also call FSBOs (though they are scarce). I also subscribe to a local listing agency for preforeclosures. I should also include that I have a full time job.

I keep pretty busy but sometimes I feel like I am spinning
my wheels. I’d be very interested in finding out what some of the others are doing with respect to having a system of business.

-Do you have an established routine when prospecting for deals from which you don’t deviate?

I think that if I can figure out a way to make it a “cookie cutter” system I’d be more successful given the time I have.

As Gerber puts it, I’d like to work “on” the business and not “for” or “in” it.

Any thoughts?

Thank you.

[Mostly Technician…sometimes Manager and yes Entrepreneur ;-}]
(You’ll get it if you read the E-myth)

2 Ways - Re: Business Systems anyone?.. - Posted by Jim

Posted by Jim on March 23, 1999 at 20:54:44:

It is very possible to have your re business make money without you being present but it does require a system.

My involvement with the late Charles Givens, Nick Koon, Ron LeGrand, and interviewing many millionaire reinvestors has given my wife and I unique perspective to making money in the business consistently. There are 2 ways to do this. First, you must train individuals to do specific functions of the business paying them for that function. These individuals get good at their specific function and you pay them from the proceeds. The second way is using the Internet. We use the Internet to buy and sell 100% of the time. Since you cannot sign contracts yet using the Internet (they should have e-signatures soon), this is the only part we use a fax.

It is not hard to find and wholesale your deals quickly to owner occupants or investors using the Internet and e-mail.

I hope this helps


Re: Business Systems anyone?.. - Posted by BankRobber

Posted by BankRobber on March 23, 1999 at 19:54:40:

my thoughts:

  1. I do Real Estate full time, so my system (or lack thereof) would be of little use to you.
  2. I am impressed that you have done as many deals as you have while holding a full time job.
  3. A full time job makes it much easier to obtain financing.
  4. You have to make a decsion, either keep your job and focus on Real Estate investment strategies that take advantage of your ability to obtain financing and are not as time intensive (i.e. rentals), or quit your job and do Real Estate investment full time. That decision would depend a lot on how much you are making in your full time job.

ps: do not underrate the value of the technician

To our sucessful investors - Posted by breeves

Posted by breeves on March 23, 1999 at 12:42:29:

Please give this question some input. I feel this is the most important question to be answered for all of us like Sheik that are trying to “make it” while having a full time job. My situation is very similar and I know I’m constantly getting side tracked due to lack of consistent focus on a process that will produce results. If I don’t get results in a month or two I lose confidence and try another approach and never develop a consistent set of actions and become frustrated with my lack of success which I know full well is due to my own shortcomings and inability to manage my time and resources productively.

Well give us something to start with - Posted by karp

Posted by karp on March 23, 1999 at 10:18:42:

Okay so you need a system that is clear, you even know you DON’T have one. SO tell us what you do have as a start.

How do you spend your time, etc?

That is the best place to start from. That is, where you are at.



Re: 2 Ways - Re: Business Systems anyone?.. - Posted by Sheik

Posted by Sheik on March 24, 1999 at 06:51:47:

Thank you Jim:
Interesting way doing business. I always thought it would be difficult to find deals via the internet (except, of course, the usual Fannie Mae,HUD and some REOs).
Are these local properties? I’d be curious to find out more.


Re: Business Systems anyone?.. - Posted by Sheik

Posted by Sheik on March 24, 1999 at 06:46:53:

Thank you …er…BankRobber :slight_smile:

And thank you for the compliment.
You are right …my full time job DOES make it easier to obtain financing since I make a decent salary.

This is the reason I choose the strategy of buying at about 80%-85% of FMV and reselling via L/O.

One of the reasons for my post was also to get some type of comparative feedback. Am I doing the right thing? Am I doing enough? etc. By you stating that you were impressed with what I’ve done made me feel that i might not be spinning my wheels after all. Thanks


Not So Fast, BankRobber - Posted by Marvin

Posted by Marvin on March 23, 1999 at 22:07:35:

Please - for those us anticipating the switch from part
time to full time investing - tell us about your system

Make it three!!! - Posted by Lonnie Turner

Posted by Lonnie Turner on March 23, 1999 at 20:23:21:

Same here!!!

Re: Well give us something to start with - Posted by Sheik

Posted by Sheik on March 23, 1999 at 11:02:53:

Thanks for responding.

As I mentioned, I have a full time job so that takes care of my days pretty much.

Here is my current routine:-

Once/Wk …

  1. Run MLS search for New REOs and Exp Listings.
  2. Scan the Sundays for new FSBOs.
  3. Mail out postcard to preforeclosures.

If there are any new REOs, I call up the Listing Realtor and take a look-see and make an offer.
Since I am basically competing with owner occupants,
deals are few and far between.

Where expireds are concerned, I get their tel# via reverse address search (most of them anyway) and call them directly regarding the sale of their home. Some of them freak out wanting to know how I got their # and how I know they have a property for sale, etc. This may be a viable way to find motivated sellers but I am a bit leery because I find myself having to explain to the owner about how I got his #, etc. which cause us to be on the defensive…(any ideas on how to handle this?)
Most of the expired, of course, are asking for FMV++, which is why the listing expired to begin with.

As for FSBOs, most are not open to creativity simply because it is not necessary with the market being hot and all.

Regarding preforeclosures. This one has me stumped. I thought I would get alot more action out of this. I mail typically 20 or so (new) postcards/week for the past 4 months…did one deal. Average response rate is
about 5 calls/month!!! with most if not all mortgaged to the hilt…130%+ of FMV.

Oh yes, I also have an Ad running for about 2 months now…no calls…no deals.

It just seems like I am doing a lot for the returns I am seeing. Or is it just me??

Thank you for all inputs.

Re: 2 Ways - Re: Business Systems anyone?.. - Posted by Jim

Posted by Jim on March 24, 1999 at 09:18:57:


The 3 biggies for MLS listings are,, and Microsoft. They are all fighting for exclusive rights to the MLS listings. We developed a small program that allows us to search web sites for the “key words” reinvestors look for on every deal.

Typically, we probably search 12-15 web sites a day for both local and national deals. Since we wholesale all of our deals for “Fast Cash” and have developed contacts throughout the country, it doesn’t really matter if the deals are local or national to do assignments.

It is our opinion that 90% of all properties are located somewhere on the Internet. The other 10% are usually ugly properties where the seller walked away and they do not have it for sale. If the seller has used any newspaper, magazine, Realtor, or electronic method of selling their house, it can usually be found on the Internet.

Even though we have completed many transactions the traditional way, we have chosen and prefer to do our deals via the Internet and e-mail. We would much prefer to e-mail a seller than call them. We would much prefer to view houses on web sites and attachments than go visit them. We would much prefer to sell to new buyers (owner occupants & investors) via e-mail than I would meeting with them and showing the house. Our strategy seems a little less “Fun” or “Exciting” because or human contact is very little, but before we switched over to full-time Internet investing in 1996, we had all the “Fun” we wanted.

I apologize for a long post. Hope this helps


Re: Not So Fast, BankRobber - Posted by BankRobber

Posted by BankRobber on March 24, 1999 at 21:33:24:

My system is primarily focused upon the exploitation of some unusual and esoteric Real Estate and Foreclosure laws in my State and the direct and indirect effects of the interaction of those laws with probate estates, bankruptcies, tax liens, judgments, naive lenders and lazy lawyers. It would not help you much even if I explained it in detail. My investments were strictly Rental Properties while I had a full time job. I did not leave my full time job until I had acquired the security of a $1500 positive cash flow from the rentals.

Re: They must call me first. - Posted by Stacy (AZ)

Posted by Stacy (AZ) on March 23, 1999 at 14:36:05:

I know the following view is not shared by everyone on this board, but that’s life. And keep in mind that I’m speaking as a realtively new investor, but with 23 years of business experience in industry.

My opinion is that a well worded and correctly targeted marketing strategy should get motivated sellers to call you. I feel it’s a waste of time to cold-call in most cases, with exceptions being rare.

Identifying correct targets and getting solidly composed sales information in their hands, I believe, is the most efficient way to expose motivation. There are plenty of tools and strategies to do this, too much for me to get into. But, in my mind, it’s a waste of my time speaking to numerous sellers when they haven’t yet been exposed to and gained an interest in what I offer.


Re: 2 Ways - Re: Business Systems anyone?.. - Posted by rayrick

Posted by rayrick on March 24, 1999 at 10:09:05:

Jim, I’ll pose the same query to you that I just did to Dan below:

I’m curious about the listed houses that you buy. Are you generally making low, all cash offers? Do you then flip them (prior to close), or get financing and sell them (either outright or with something like a contract or a L/O)? It seems to me the big downside to buying listed properties is it is harder to structure creative terms when there is a realtor involved. Has that been your experience?


Re: They must call me first. - Posted by Sheik

Posted by Sheik on March 23, 1999 at 15:39:09:

Thank you Stacy.
At one time I was doing mailings to expire listings but as Breeves pointed out above, I too, am guilty of jumping from one strategy to another when I see no action. Maybe therein lies my problem.