Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA on April 04, 2002 at 17:45:50:
Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA on April 04, 2002 at 17:45:50:
How long do MHs stay listed with agent? - Posted by Corey_CA
Posted by Corey_CA on April 02, 2002 at 15:09:27:
How long does a MH stay listed w/ a real estate agent?
Does anybody buy MHs through an agent?
MHs are expensive here. Here are some numbers I am playing with:
1970 single wide, 2br/1ba --> Asking 28,000.
I purchase for 17k cash, and sell at 27k w/financing, 2k down. Here are the numbers (subtracting the down):
Keep playing but don’t get serious. - Posted by Ddr. Craig Whisler CA
Posted by Ddr. Craig Whisler CA on April 02, 2002 at 19:04:23:
$17k is about $16k too much for a 1970 single wide, even in your town (whereever it is). Keep playing but don’t get serious about paying that kind of money. If you want to throw your money away I’ve included my e-mail address at the bottom of this post. I’ll take it.
You get an A for effort Corey. You really are trying. Most folks spend their spare time watching Geraldo. All they will ever get out of it is a good laugh. You will get some good money out of your efforts.
Your post indicates a very common problem many people encounter when starting out. You just scratch your head and wonder if other people are BSing you about buying mobiles so cheaply. It seems like you can’t do it in YOUR area, right? Well in time you will probably learn that it really can be done. I wouldn’t ever expect to get a killer deal from an agent. Corey if I were an agent and a seller wanted to list his mobile with me for the prices that experienced Lonnie dealers buy for, I would buy it myself.
Many agents are hungry but that is not what is meant by a motivated seller. The price you indicate is super retail, not sub wholesale.
You will need to buy directly from desperate sellers or from referals from park managers (to motivated sellers), to get the kind of deals we are talking about. Just before the seller is about to abandon his mobile and walk away and let the park have it for back rent is when the seller is really movitated to take practically anything you offer.
Don’t lose heart Corey. You are 90% to your goal already. You can see the rainbow in your mind and the pot of gold is nearby. I feel that in only a week or two more, in parks looking for desperate motivated sellers, you will find your your first steal/deal. Once you get your first one a light will go on in your head and you will think ahaaaaa, so that how it they do it. Fasten your seat belt Corey because once you get your first deal like the one you mention for only $1,000 you will be hopeless hooked on Lonnie deals. There will be no turning back after that because you will soon find a second deal very similar to the first one and make a $4,000 profit for 4 hours work, you will ask yourself in utter amazement: “Why would I every want to work for wages again”.
Be persistent. Don’t give up. I know you can do it. Especially hang in here on this board where you have thousands of successful Lonnie dealers to hold your hand and walk you through your first 2-3 deals. Shortly thereafter when we see you posting on this board it will be to answwer questions from other newbies who have just tuned in.
Regards, doc email@example.com
To really answer your question… - Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA
Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA on April 02, 2002 at 19:17:09:
…the length of the listing period is negotiable.
Here is the way it will go down. The agent will ask for an exclusive LIFETIME listing and you should offer a 3-6 week non-exclusing listing, THAT ALSO ALLOWS YOU TO SELL IT YOURSELF WITHOUT PAYING ANY COMMISSION. the agent will balk, till you offer to take your listing to one of his competiors.
Corey you hold ALL of the barganing chips in this kind of situation.
Nearly all Lonnie dealers sell themselves. You may be making a mistake to use and agent exclusively. You can almost always do it better with less hassel by yourself. Its Ok to try an agent once in a while if you can still sell yourself without paying a commission. It is all negotiable, DESPITE what the agent may try to tell you. If he says its customary to do it his way you just say your custom is to do it YOUR way when it is your mobile and money. Don’t let agents BS you. You BS them.
No, I wasn’t going to use an agent - Posted by Corey
Posted by Corey on April 02, 2002 at 23:41:10:
I was going to find out how long they were going to stay with the agent. I figured that if it didn’t sell, I would have a better chance of getting the MH even cheaper.
And sorry, but MHs are expensive here. The MH parks are 100% full, and people are willing to pay big bucks just so they can rent the lot. Go figure.
I’ve seen newer double wides going for up to 200k, and that’s without the lot. Most older single wides are 60k.
I thought that I read that a Lonnie Deal can even work in expensive areas, just with bigger numbers. Are you suggesting that I not do anything over 5k?
yes, at least for your first 3 deals. - Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA
Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA on April 03, 2002 at 02:32:01:
What area are you from? Are you from Alaska, Hawaii, or San Francisco? Maybe it is more expensive than Southern CA. Corey give me a few more details.
yes, at least for your first 3 deals. - Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA
Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA on April 03, 2002 at 02:29:03:
What area are you from? Are you from Alaska, Hawaii, or Sanfrancisco? Maybe it is more expensive than Southern CA.
Re: What about Los Angeles? - Posted by Ralph Hollins
Posted by Ralph Hollins on April 03, 2002 at 10:27:52:
It is great to hear from you.
I have a pressing question about using Carlton’s program successfully when buying properties of any kind in the greater metropolitan area of Los Angeles
Ca. Who is using the Zero down strategy? Where are they using it? What are the pro’s and con’s of being successful Los Angeles? Are there any nitch markets that have great potential?
The Los Angeles cost for virtually any kind of home is virtually so high it begs the question…How do I make it work?
Reply to Corey and Doc Whistler - Posted by Jim Pack (GA-FL)
Posted by Jim Pack (GA-FL) on April 03, 2002 at 07:47:43:
I read through this conversation and I noticed that Corey has the same problem I was seeing during my online searches. Most everything I found was WAY overpriced, usually by the realtor. Corey, see my reply to SURVEY question.
It was only when I got out and rode around with a guy actually making a living doing Lonnie Deals, that I saw the true picture. Almost every mobile home park we went to (at least 8) there were people giving away mobile homes. Some owed lot rent and would gladly just walk away from it if you offered to take it and pay the back rent. Yet, at the same time, I could look in the paper and see ads for a 1985 14x60 for $25,000 in a park where the land wasn’t even included. Go figure! My father-in-law owns a MH in a 55+ park in Naples, FL. They bought it for $20,000 and spent another $30,000 upgrading it. There’s no way in hell they are gonna get $50,000 for it and they know it but they’ll ask for it anyway when they sell. You just gotta keep looking and you’ll find a deal. It may not be obvious at first but they are out there.
It’s been a long time since I was living in CA and I know the real estate has gotten very expensive since I used to live there. If MH parks are that in demand, it might be a great place to start a park of your own someday.
I haven’t done my first Lonnie Deal yet because I am trying to retire from the military and relocate to another city about an hour south from me. I joined a Real Estate Investor’s Club in that city and it really got me on the right track. I highly recommend you doing the same if its available. You can learn far more, far faster if you have people by your side, helping you.
Doc, what is your background? After reading some of your posts, it seems you owned a MH Park once and have been doing Lonnie Deals for awhile. What do you say about California Real Estate?
Jim Pack (GA-FL)
Like trying to herd cats. - Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA
Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA on April 03, 2002 at 12:40:16:
I like Carleton Sheets. I think he has a good program and it is a good course for beginners to start with. I have his course myself along with 75 others so it is easy to compare different writers.
Getting started is much harder in my opinion that the course makes it seem. Yes it works and yes YOU can do it but it is sufficiently hard that probably only 2% are ever as wildly successful as the lucky folks you see on his infomercials. If investing in real estate is so easy, then why isn’t Calrleton doing it full time. Truth be told, he is probably doing what makes him the most money with the least amount of effort, selling books and tapes. Wouldn’t you?
Real estate goes in cycles. At times we have sellers markets, like now, in my area, at other times we have buyers markets. Carleton, in his infinite wisdom, has somehow forgotten to tell you that. Prices are high now and good terms are hard to come by. Geting no down and free equity deals is about as hard as trying to herd cats. No down in most areas means no equity. No equity in most areas means negative cash flow.
Prices are so high in the Los Angeles areas that only very experienced investors “succeed wildly”, but they still do succeed, inspite of the seller’s market. At other times in the real estate business cycle it will be a buyer’s market when prices are down, sales are slow and great deals can be negotiated MUCH MORE EASILY than now. Carleton sells his courses day in and day out. What would happen to his sales if he told you that right now it is a sellers market and you will find it very hard to get good buys that will have positive cash flow with nothing down on $300,000 houses in Los Angeles? There is a time and season for all things. A time for buying and time for waiting and a time for selling. These times will NOT be uniform all over the country. Often yhou make your best profits by going against the trends. Buy when everyone is selling and sell when everyone is buying.
You can most easily get a good start when there is a down market when everyone else is AFRAID to buy (this also means when YOU are afraid to buy) for whatever reason. Maybe prices are dropping. That DOES happen in most business and real estate cycles. Maybe companies are laying off workers in droves, or interest rates are too high, or there has just been a terrorist attack on your block, etc. etc. What do you think causes down markets in the first place? If everyone was buying it wouldn’t be a down market. Baron Rothschild said “Buy when the blood is flowing in the streets” (when everyone is scared to death and panic selling causes prices to take a dump). It takes real guts to be buying when the tanks are rolling down your street.
Even though we are in a sellers market now there are ALWAYS exceptions, niche markets and, CERTAIN AREAS where great deals can be found (read MADE rather than found). I can find 3 bedroon houses in nice areas for under $50k anytime in my area of Southern California 'coz I’ve done my homework. I can get decent FREE mobiles in Los Angeles, Orange, Riverside, and San Bernardino Coundies RIGHT NOW TODAY. I have seen many deals in the past 2 years where decent 3 bedroom, one bath houses (1,000 sq ft.) sold for from $12,00o to $25,000 right here within a 60 mile radius of my home. I saw a couple like this sold about 3 weeks ago.
Nontheless people from Southern California continue to say it can’t be done. Houses in Southern California cost $350,000 and mobiles are selling for $100,000 and up. When people say that what I really hear is that is that THEY haven’t learned enough about their investing business to be successful yet. They want to challenge susscssful posters to just GIVE then a good deal to prove to them that it can be done. Sorry folks, I wouldn’t hold my breath if I were you.
Am I going to tell you where they are so you can take the bread out of my mouth? Maybe you can guess the answer to that all by yourself. Why should I work my arse off to just give away my work product. I’m not going to do that. Its a no brainer.
OK now lets just get right down to the nitty gritty. What you really want to know is how you can get yourselves into the position where you CAN find these deals, right? Well I WILL tell you that, but I suspect you’re not going to like the answer as much as I do.
To be continued in a day or two. I gotta head on into town now for my breakfast Big Mac.
Corey, take 2 aspirin and read 20 times before… - Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA
Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA on April 03, 2002 at 12:58:01:
…ever again suggesting that it can’t be done the way we say. This post should become your personal mantra. Read it over and over. As one poster child says, READ 'TIL YOUR EYES BLEED. Jim hasn’t even done it yet, but he CAN do it any time he wants, because HE knows how. Ask and ye shall receive.
Trying to herd cats. Part 2 continuation - Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA
Posted by Dr. Craig Whisler CA on April 06, 2002 at 01:29:02:
Ok OK, here is the nity grity about hou YOU can get yourself into a position where you can do GREAT deals in ANY market and in ANY area. The reason I said you aren’t going to like it is because it requires a LOT OF WORK. It takes time and money but its not DIFFICULT to do. I believe that 90% of the readers of this board can do it, in time. Unless you plan to die tommorrow I assume you have lots of time ahead of you. You can spend every minute of it. DEMAND your money’s worth or get ripped off. The choice is yours.
STEP 1 The secret is really no secret at all. You must read every investing book you can find. You need to go to every seminar and convention that you can afford and some that you can’t afford. Get your hands on every set of real estate investment tapes you can beg borrow or steal. Listen to them until your ears could probably do some of the easier deals all by themselves.
STEP 2 Read EVERYTHING ON THIS BOARD. Yes I know it will take you a year to do but you will have a TREMENDOUS amount of knowledge when you are done. this is a knowledge game. You need a BIG bag of tricks if you are to beat out your competitors.
STEP 3 Get yourself some GOOD personal mentors. Make friends with everyone you can on lthis board. Get home phone numbers and e-mail addresses. Thank the posters who give you good advice and help you solve your problems.
STEP 4 Join every local, state, and National investor club and association you can find. If you can’t find a local club START YOUR OWN. Some experienced and helpful investors are likely to show up eventually.
STEP 5 Read, Think And Grow Rich, The Richest Man In Babylon, and Rich Dad Poor Dad, Get a set of Tony Robbins tapes (without fail). You can probably get a used set cheap on E-Bay Auctions. Type “Real Estate” in their search engine. Get Joe Kaiser’s books (all of them) on this website.
STEP 6 go out and do as many deals as possible. There is absolutely NO substitute for experience. If you really can’t get any good deals in your area then for goodnes sake MOVE. You aren’t a tree with roots permanently attached to the ground, as Jimmy Napier always says. Either MOVE or accept the fact that you will be flipping Big Macs for the rest of your life instead of getting rich in 5-10 years.
STEP 7 Get yourself $10,000 worth of house payments and just HANG ON. Eventually your mortgages will be paid off and inflation will carry you inexorably upward to your goals: Jimmy Napier again.
STEP 8 When you eventually get solvent and have a little cash to work with, invest in YOURSELF. I would reccoment buying EVERY book on this website that relates to what you are doing. Get a superior education early-on so you will be able to benefit from it for the rest of your life. You can work hard or work smart. Take you pick. Life is hard for the poor. It is easier to get rich than to endure the pain of poverty.
STEP 9 Have WRITTEN goals. When you go through the Tony Robbins tapes you will learn something about written goals that will literally blow your socks off. This one item will likely multiply your future success by 10,000%. I’m not going to give away Tony’s work product. Get his tapes. This is one of the single most important things I ever did. Robbins is highly recommended. Even his older set of tapes is fine if you are on a budget. You cn look for a used set of tapes on E-Bay under “real estate” in their search engine. Get a biography or autobiography of Warren Buffet and learn how he became one of the richest men in America on a mere 23% per year average return on his money (starting with nothing). Then compare his rate of return, and use your financial calculator, to see how much you can beat him by, by simply starting NOW with LONNIE DEALS.
STEP 10 Get a financial calculator and make it your best friend. Set a goal to become an expert with it. Learn to understand the EIGTH WONDER OF THE WORLD-----COMPOUND INTEREST. lEARN WHY 1% OF THE WORLDS POPULATION OWNS 75% OF THE WORLDS WEALTH. Resolve to get yourself into that 1%. It is not 1/100th as hard to do as you may think. You only need to know how.
STEP 11 Become your own tax expert. Learn all you can stand about taxes and how to avoid them as much as possible (legally).
Well now you know why I said you pobably wont like the answer. It is lots of work and will take you years to do. This is EXACTLY what I did, with the exception of geting all of the books on this website and I hope to have them all soon. If you ever wonder why I seem to have a lot of knowledge, well now you know why. I got it the old fashioned way. I worked for it. I love to read and have a hugh collection of real estate investing books. You have to pay your own dues in life. OK so this might take you 10 years to do. So what? How old will you be in 10 years if you DON’T do it? How old will you be if you do do it?
One definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over but expecting different results. If you want different results (from what you have now) you need to set in motion DIFFERENT causes. Guess when the best time to start would be?
Ok, what say you? Is this truth or BS?
Re: Like trying to herd cats. - Posted by Billy Boy
Posted by Billy Boy on April 03, 2002 at 22:19:27:
I agree wholeheartedly with your post. But do you know why herding cats is so difficult? It’s because they are smarter than
either cattle or dogs. Example: Nobody, but NOBODY ever hitched eight cats to a sled and got them to pull it through the snow!
Just getting into the beginning stages of mobile home deals…own a few pieces of rental property. Abilene Texas may be the armpit of the world, but you can still buy a brick 1br,1bath townhouse for 30K. A decent three bedroom,bath and a half in a good area for 40k with a one car garage. People who owned real estate in Cal who move here live like kings…but you can hang it up if you go the other way. Keep up the good posts with all the other good people 0n this site.
Re: High Priced MHs - Posted by Chuck-NY
Posted by Chuck-NY on April 03, 2002 at 13:54:48:
I will be patient…I wondered about buying at low prices when I first started out and yet…I sometimes grow tired of hearing…“can it be done?” So for the sakes of those who don’t believe, here are the prices
I have paid for some of my MHs…starting with very first one…
$1,000, $500, $5,600 (loan payments of $175/mo.),
$500, $2,200, $2,000, these are real purchase prices.
I also bought 3 at once from a local park for: $500,
$1,000, & $500. All the aforementioned homes have been sold. These are a sampling of my complete inventory.
YES this business works even though my wife said 2 1/2
years ago “yeah but not in New York State” my wife no longer believes her statement…
I live in the central part of upstate NY (600 miles from New York City). Now NYC is another story…I know
that people down there are finding old used MHs going for $25,000+…single wide !! Having said that and having the knowledge about used MHs I would EASILY say
that this business is worth moving to !! If you can’t find a place in your area that has good MH deals then find a place that’s a ways from home and move there. I realise what I am saying and there is not enough room in my house for everyone on this site so NO you are not invited to move in with me !! However, there is more MH business in central NY than I could ever handle.
Re: Like trying to herd cats. - Posted by brad
Posted by brad on April 04, 2002 at 10:42:30:
i have to step in here and give my 2 cents…first we are trained from early childhood to strive for success and that was always get a good job ect. in order for this to work you have to look past that job that is feeding you and see what your boss is doing, reeping the benifits of your misconseptions about life. my hardest obstical has not been finding deals or putting in offers/bids. but it has been waiting for the acception letter. i actually expected to get turned down and go pick up my money and go on with my life. now i have so many deals coming my way that i need to get some sold so i can take advantage. if all you do is worry and say what if you will get old and be the guy that tells everyone it cant be done. “weather you think you can or you cant your right” Henry Ford.
I’m from San Luis Obispo - Posted by Corey_SLO_CA
Posted by Corey_SLO_CA on April 03, 2002 at 16:14:48:
Thanks for the responses.
I have driven through over 12 mobile home parks, and wrote down every for sale sign I could find (my wife came with me, totally on board, so we had eyes on both sides of the lane). I’ve called all of them, and the least expensive was 25k for a SW 10x58 (yes, the ones that are usually given away).
So, Maybe San Luis Obispo is like NYC. I’m starting out here, and I’m going to go for it. I couldn’t find anything here, so I tried Morro Bay (15 miles away) and I’ve moved onto Santa Margarita and Atascadero (20 miles away). I’m going to keep trying, and yes, I may have to be farther away to do this then in my backyard.
I guess my question was, should I pay more to do this in my backyard, or should I do this 60-150 miles away to get the good prices?
I can’t move away from the area, but I sure do have a car, and I can drive
and NO, I’m not saying “it can’t be done here”. I’m saying, “I’m finding out how I can do Lonnie Deals.”
Re: Like trying to herd cats. - Posted by samantha
Posted by samantha on April 06, 2002 at 10:13:43:
Excellent post, doc. I would have only a couple of things to ad to that and it is absolutely going to be regarded as a girl’s point of view by you guys. While you are working your backside off trying to make a living and trying to get ahead, MAKE SURE you take time to make a LIFE too. Remember to schedule in time for your wife, girlfriend and family. Yeah, you DO have to schedule it just like a dental appointment because otherwise, you just never seem to find the time. I understand completely. SCHEDULE time with your kids, too, if you have them. Even when you are tired. Even when you are broke. Even when you are overwhelmed with problems. As doc so correctly pointed out, in 10 years you will either be further ahead than you are now or you will still be spinning your wheels where you are now. Either way, your children will be 10 years older and USED to the fact that dad was never around (or mom). They will build a life that does not include YOU. While you are getting rich, remember to nurture the things that make living worthwhile. Otherwise, what is the use of the money with no one to share it with? Paul McCartney says money can’t buy me love…he lied, it CAN. But only for a short period of time. The things that last forever are the things that take time to build. On your path to financial enlightenment, don’t forget your family. Just my opinion, of course…hope it was not too off the subject.
Re: I’m from San Luis Obispo - Posted by Jerry Freeman
Posted by Jerry Freeman on April 03, 2002 at 16:34:06:
I’m near Chuck-NY, but in a more rural area about 75 miles north of him. I have to drive a minimum of 35 miles to the nearest MH park I can work. At first, I found the driving wore me down, but now, it’s routine.
I don’t know anything about your area, except I believe I’ve heard that the SF Bay area is supposed to be one of the most expensive. I wouldn’t hazard to guess how far away you’ll need to go to reach the cheaper prices, but I’ll be looking forward to your reports on this board. What people are paying for in those high-price areas isn’t the trailer, it’s the priviledge of parking a trailer on a lot in that locale. The parks tend to be 100% full, and getting a place to live of any description is expensive, so the MHs in those markets tend to be very high.
There’s alot of truth in them words… (nt) - Posted by Chuck
Posted by Chuck on April 06, 2002 at 20:00:47:
Absolutely right - Posted by Corey_SLO_CA
Posted by Corey_SLO_CA on April 03, 2002 at 16:49:22:
You hit the nail on the head. Parks are 100% full, and people pay high prices so they can have the priveledge of renting the lot. Just got a call today from another PM, lot rent is $400/mo on a single wide.
I’m not in the bay area. I’m about 2.5-3.5 hours south of it. Our prices are very similar to that of the bay area, though our salary ranges are quite a bit weaker.
(about 150 miles inland and I’m sure I’ll find some Lonnie Deals)