I just discovered a realtor trick - Posted by sean

Posted by Jim FL on April 26, 2002 at 24:02:45:

Ed,
Okay, you like a good rant now and then, but frankly, how did your post address what the original post was talking about?
For example:
You said: "It is true that an “investor” can go around telling little stories that bend the truth, or not state things that need to be known, but this investor will be in the 90% that will be gone in a very short time."
What??
Where on earth did you get that this investor stated something that was untue or did not state things that needed to be known?
Was this investor supposed to tell the agent he spoke to that he had already completed some research on the property he was inquiring about?
I don’t think so.
This is called an “Edge” in negotiations.
Heck, if I talk to a seller who tells me that their mortgage is current, and I conduct due diligence on it and find otherwise, am I supposed to just accept what the seller says?
NO WAY!

As for not defending realtors? (or agents or brokers), I beg to differ.
I understand, heck I often defend investors.
But, not blindly.
When an investor, or anyone for that matter, is slime, I call it like it is.

I just do not see where this investor did anything wrong at all.
So, rather than try to address your post, which in my opinion has NOTHING to do with the original post, I’ll just close with one question…

What EXACTLY did this investor do that was trickery?
What did he do wrong?
And, (okay, a few questions.)
When you tell me what he did wrong, please explain in detail how and why?
And, offer a solution for handling this better.

After all, many are here to learn.

Should we just assume that an agent or broker will always give all the facts and be honest?

Sadly, it has been my experience that a confused mind ALWAYS says “No”, and by and large, many times without even knowing it, Realtors/agents/brokers are confused.
It is this lack of understanding that makes many of them miss out on getting paid by me.
Over the last two or three years I can count on 3 fingers the number of times an agent or broker has earned a commission from me.
And frankly, I don’t care.
I get enough deals.

I guess I’m just part of the 10%, WITHOUT going to those who “have the properties to sell”.
Which they do, and would sell a whole lot faster and for more profit if they would just open their minds.

Anyway, enough “Ranting” from me,
Jim FL

I just discovered a realtor trick - Posted by sean

Posted by sean on April 24, 2002 at 15:23:02:

When you find a deal that involves a REALTOR, there is a trick I just discovered, quite by accident :slight_smile:

Do your homework first, find out as much as you can before calling the realtor. Then call the office, tell them you want the address to one of their listings. DO NOT ASK FOR THE LISTING AGENT!!!
With any luck you get another agent, they will, of course give you more info than the listing agent.

Example:
I just called about a duplex in my area. I intend to L/O it. In my area, rentals are VERY hard to sell, but it can be done, and of course while sellers would L/O REALTORs try to avoid this all together.
I did all my home work, even to the point of talking to tenants. Then I called the office, asked for the address (it wasn’t on the mail box and I never did ask the tenants)and the woman that answered the phone WASN’T the agent selling the place.
She went on and on, telling every thing about the place ( I already knew most of it) and when I asked about a L/O she say’s " Oh yes, Mr. seller would be very interested in a L/O. He really would like to unload this house, he’s retiring you see. He has several others in the same area not listed yet, I think if you could come up with a package deal you may be able to get them all!!!" She then gave me all the details about his 13!!! Buildings, 41 units in all, and over 198000 dollars cash flow a year. Eureaka

About then the realtor who’s listing it was got on the phone and made it a point to tell me she didn’t think he would ever do such a thing, blah blah blah.
I’ve made my offer and have my fingers crossed.

I don’t know if anyone else has done this, or had such a lucky break, but I’ll be doing this more often LOL

sean

Ha, that’s an old one. - Posted by GL(ON)

Posted by GL(ON) on April 25, 2002 at 19:51:23:

Most experienced investors make it a practice never to deal with the listing agent. They always get another agent to represent them. Why not, it costs you nothing?

If you find a good agent and let them represent you all the time, they will be working for your interest even though theoretically they are working for (and getting paid by) the seller.

Just make sure that one agent gets commission check after commission check and see how well she can take care of you.

Re: I just discovered a realtor trick - Posted by Tom

Posted by Tom on April 25, 2002 at 07:31:34:

I have found that agents have a tendency to provide alot of information upfront when I call, even the listing agent, then after they divulged details, they ask “and which office do you work for?”, thinking I am an agent. So while not necessarily a trick, it is more of the agent not knowing who they are talking to.

Re: I just discovered a realtor trick - Posted by Betty FL

Posted by Betty FL on April 25, 2002 at 05:19:51:

Sean
Make the offer to the Realtor and ask (very politely)
to be present when she presents the offer to the buyer.
This must be done in person. In today’s market, most of the offers are given verbally by phone, from Realtor
to Seller. However, the Realtor still has the written offer in the office. Hope I did not confuse you.
Betty

Re: At the point that you called - Posted by Ed Copp (OH)

Posted by Ed Copp (OH) on April 24, 2002 at 20:31:12:

the Realtor, you obligated the seller to owe a commission to the Realtor, in most cases. Unless of course your are real “tricky” and did not give them your name, or used a false name. Hopefully they do not have caller I.D., or you were “tricky” enough to call from a pay phone, etc.

This business is really not about turning tricks…

Re: I just discovered a realtor trick - Posted by Bryan (VA)

Posted by Bryan (VA) on April 25, 2002 at 11:27:15:

Forget about asking the Realtor to be present!!! Why not write into the offer…
“I reserve the right to be present when offer is presented to Seller”, and then you decide if you can make it or not…

oh, alright - Posted by Jim FL

Posted by Jim FL on April 24, 2002 at 23:41:53:

Ed,
Just curious, but why did you even say this?
Seems to me after reading his post that not once did he say he was trying to skirt the issue of a commission on the sale.
I know you are a RE agent or broker, but sheesh man, just because someone found a way to gather info about a property as well as a sellers situation, without having the listing agent KILL the idea outright, why come down on them.
“turning tricks”?
What?
Sadly, over all, those of us who are NOT agents or brokers, and just plain old investors often are forced to deal with agents and brokers who just plain do not understand creative real estate and will often kill offers as they are presented, if they are, just because of their own lack of understanding.
Honestly, we all know there are some very good agents and brokers out there, but by and large the majority are not “Creative investor friendly”.
I love it when an agent says to me, "What SEMINAR did you just graduate from or attend?"
My reply is usually something like…"How many houses do you sell in a month?"
Most reply with a rather low number, and it is fun to tell them that I BOUGHT more than that last month!

Sorry Ed, did not mean to rant, I just don’t think that Sean was trying to “turn tricks”.
He/she merely found a way to "Jump thru the often un-needed and unwanted hoops RE agent/brokers impose upon us.
Hence the reason we spend our money to market for sellers and rarely pay commissions.
It is the agents loss though, not mine.

Have a nice day,
Jim FL

Re: I just discovered a realtor trick - Posted by Betty FL

Posted by Betty FL on April 25, 2002 at 17:40:54:

Bryan, Thank you for catching my mistake. I must have left my brain in bed. I do apologize for any problem I may have caused.
Thanks
Betty

Re: I like a good rant now and then. - Posted by Ed Copp (OH)

Posted by Ed Copp (OH) on April 25, 2002 at 21:00:51:

I seldom defend incompetence in a Realtor, which is rampant. But Realtors seem to be so all important, after all they have the properties to sell. Most investors are not willing to put forth the effort to find a good deal (not unlike Realtors). So what happens is the overpriced, shopworn listings on the MLS are fought over by all. After all the MLS is nothing more than a “list” of properties that nobody could sell (to date). The real estate business, and this includes private investing is about a 90/10 business. That is to say that 90% of the folks involved will do about 10% of the business with or without a license.

Then on the other hand the 10% who are knowledgable will slurp up 90% of the good deals. Most of them a long time before anyone ever considered a Realtor, or putting the property on some kind of a list (MLS).

It is all about education, it is not about trickery. It is true that an “investor” can go around telling little stories that bend the truth, or not state things that need to be known, but this investor will be in the 90% that will be gone in a very short time. It is very hard to disclose something that is unknown to you. Education can teach what needs to be disclosed, and then the individual can decide. I pretty much think that a good established investor will disclose things that make a difference to sellers and buyers just as a competent Realtor would.

On the other hand the con artists generally do not last too long. The problem is that they do a lot of damage to the industry before they finally move on. It is often mentioned that I defend Realtors, and this is not the case. More specifically I have a problem with the folks who disregard written contracts. A listing being probably the most often skirted. If you are a con artist then your signature on a contract probably means nothing, and this goes for sellers as well as buyers. Far too often I see that it is common to just disregard the written contract, it seems to be looked at as an entitlement by the biggest part of the 90% who are on the way out anyway. The problem is that the other 10% will have to clean up thier mess. Thus the dozens of pages of disclosure items in a real estate transaction. The only soultion that I see, that works is education.

Re: oh, alright - Posted by Kent

Posted by Kent on April 25, 2002 at 19:48:36:

I would send the owner a letter or call him informing that I buy houses in the area. If you are lucky maybe the deal-killing agent did not get all the listings on the balance of the properties this owner has in his stockpile. He will still get his commission on the 1 deal but he may lose the big picture because of his lack of creative thinking.

Amen!!! No Msg - Posted by Mclean

Posted by Mclean on April 25, 2002 at 04:23:13:

!