a bad name… That… that is why all our elected officials use them…
You use them for one reason and one reason only…
Because they work…
It was proven long ago… that bad publicity can be good publicity in the right hands…
People have very short memories…
I would say Ask them what their problem is… I might even ask them if they were going to pay my bills, clothe my child… and create more passive income for me to pass on to my heirs…
Because if not… I don’t see where they really have a say… It’s not like they are in your car, while your driving drunk… and that’s my philosophy If your not driving drunk… then it doesn’t effect them and they don’t a say…
As far as what you can do about it, I don’t know. If someone has a gridge on you and you find it out, you can call them up and straighten it out.
Other than that, if you keep on long enough and the sky doesn’t fall, they will get used to you and accept you, maybe even brag on you a little. Same as what happened with your friends and family after you stuck with it long enough and had some success.
You could not see a difference between my bandit signs and my magnetic signs on my car. Same size, same colors, same ad! There is not one bit of difference between the two other than one is attached to the car and the other is attached to a stake or utility pole.
BTW, I think MY signs look gooooood!!! You can see them coming from a mile away! LOL
I don’t know why bandit signs can’t be handled the same as open house signs because each city regulation will have their own ideas about it. Not only is it the city regulation that will determine their use, but you have to remember a lot of these signs stay up because of non-enforcement of that regulation.
If I had to take a stab in the dark on this, I would think it has to do with ‘groups’ coming out in favor or displeasure of the issue. If the city is going to regulate signs, you are going to have all the real estate agents and companies making sure they still have a way to market and earn a living. They will lobby at city hall and with council members to make sure the regulations won’t hamper them too much.
But when you have citizens and city officials designing their sign regulation, they probably had lots of residents (group) saying no to ‘bandit’ signs. I don’t think you saw a bunch of investors, all getting together as a significant body (group); and voice their opinions that they be allowed to earn their living also and be allowed to market.
Posted by JHyre in Ohio on March 06, 2002 at 20:11:35:
Probably a little, but a WHOLE lot less…the question would then be…where would it end? Do I then have to put up with fancy, beautifully enamelled weight loss signs on every corner for 1/2 of Sunday? My major issue- trash in the gutter- goes away, and the realtor signs also tend to be alot less ugly, but I’m not sure where the “slippery slope” would lead.
If you read all my stuff you must have noticed how nice I can be, especially to newbies and beginners. I have often spent a lot of time and brain sweat to give a sincere and I hope helpful answer to someone when everyone else was flaming them like a cheap barbecue.
I guess I hate to see someone picked on when they are down, especially if they are trying to better themselves. That doesn’t go for me and you and Tim. We are big boys who supposedly know what we are doing and can stick up for ourselves.
By the way, if you keep saying such nice things about me you are going to make Tim jealous LOL LOL LOL.
Well Tim you asked a question, and I gave my opinion. Whether I am right or wrong I can’t possibly know since I have never met you or your friends.
You happened to touch a couple of sore spots regarding reputation and character. I think these things are more important than most people realise, from a business standpoint alone.
If we were involved in a business deal this would be uppermost in my mind: How far can I trust this guy? Will he keep his word no matter what? Will he keep it only as long as it suits him, and stab me in the back if that pays better? Or is he a con man and a chiseler who is lying to me right now?
I’m not saying you are any of those things. I am saying these are the kind of questions I ask myself.
Now here is one thing I know about you. You will put up illegal bandit signs and you will trespass on someone else’s property to put up signs. Knowing you are doing something wrong, but not caring as long as you don’t get in trouble for it and justifying it as doing no harm.
Now I know you will do that just to stick up a few signs. What would you do for $1000? $10,000? What would you do if you saw a way to cheat me out of $50,000 if you knew that no one would find out and if you did get caught, there is nothing anyone could do about it?
On the contrary. People will hold a grudge for things that happened generations ago. Every time someone does something to reinforce a bad image, it reflects on all of us.
Haven’t you ever had anyone accuse you of taking advantage of people and ripping them off because of real estate investing, even though they know nothing about you? Look at all the hullaballoo about that Japanese billionaire evicting 250 families in California. Do you suppose that is all about him, or is it accumulated resentment going back years? And what about the long term effects? He won’t care, but every investor in California is going to be feeling the fallout for years whether they know it or not.
You are right, I don’t have any say. That ticks me off even more, if someone is giving me a black eye and there is nothing I can do about it.
Do you really believe there is no way to do this business without breaking the law and making people mad? If that was true I would have gotten into some other line of work years ago. You can certainly be honest, and build up your community while making money for yourself.
You sound like the typical ignorant jerk who believes every business must automatically be crooked and shady, and every businessman a theif. And that therefore it is OK to cheat the landlord and wreck his property.
I’m not really sore at you. You can’t possibly believe what your message says. I suppose you must be trying a little sarcasm, to needle me into a “hot” reply. Well here you go.
… BTW, I think MY signs look gooooood!!!
… You can see them coming from a mile away! LOL
What I have been noticing lately is that when I am traveling around, one investor’s signs are not where they usually are. But instead is another investor’s sign. One struck me as strange because it is in a location that if it was taken out of the ground, where did it go when all the other signs stayed, and this new one popped in for the other investor? Strange.
Now I dont’ want to say this new sign guy is taking out a fellow investor’s sign that I know, but it does seem strange that the one advertising there for months, now has his sign gone and a new investor’s sign is in that place.
Someone out there don’t like the new guy’s sign though. On some poles, someone has taken the lower left of the sign and the lower right of the sign, and broke off those parts. This leaves the phone number unrecognizaable and is useless.
It’s funny to my wife and I when we are out and see them. It’s so funny because we too see them from a good distance away and we laugh because it is a useless sign on a telephone pole.
BTW, I called the investor who had the sign locations ‘first’ and left a message. I think he will call tonight and I wanted to let him know. That is if he doesn’t know already.
Posted by JHyre in Ohio on March 06, 2002 at 19:34:31:
The fact that they are on YOUR car makes them booootiful! Well, not quite, but alot less repugnant in my view. And no litter. Driving an u-g-l-y car is your business, putting signs on property that I pay for is not.
If you want to put me in a tough spot, ask whether government should be allowed to regulate ugly signs voluntarily placed on private property by the owners…I HATE meddling bureaucrats and I HATE ugly bandit signs…hard call. To quote Ditka, “Da Bears!”, I’d probably view the potential for government abuse as the worse of the two evils. However, given that we already HAVE abusive government, I’ll spend my frustration railing against the friggin signs…unless, of course, they are on YOUR car, LOL.
I tend to agree with you. Too bad this is the only thing that seems to work consistently well in finding motivated sellers. After reading this board, I am tempted to try it. Wish there were a legal way to do it that was cost-effective. I was thinking about putting some out on weekends like the realtors do with the open house signs. Maybe that would be a sort of middle-ground approach.
Posted by JHyre in Ohio on March 06, 2002 at 18:08:53:
Actually, I have noticed that…sort of a Hyde & Jeckyll thing. Nothing wrong with smacking a big boy, it’s just that different people have different reactions that should be taken into account. Given my profession and general personality, I am generally pretty polite until hacked off…and then become VERY rude. I also will be the first to make nice with an erstwhile opponent once the dust settles, assuming that they have some redeeming feature beyond providing CO2 for plants. Most people have probably figured that out by now…and they’ll get a feel for you too, though they may interpret your quirks differently than you. I’d still hold back on personalizing things a bit, if I were you…but that’s your call, dependent purely on your goals in posting here and whether or not you think your present style furthers those goals. I am a little careful when I post on bandit signs…it’s an issue of taste & manners for me, but an issue of livlihood for many. The fact that people make a living off of the things does not change my opinion one whit…but I am a little careful on the expression end (at least I THINK I am)…kindof like trying to explain the Wealth of Nations & NAFTA to a Detroit union worker- you may be right, but the audience ain’t very friendly. The difference between the union guy and the posters here- I wish to maintain relationships here and am therefore a little more tactful than I might be with the UAW. My opinion on bandit signs may not be popular, but hopefully it and my approach are respected.
I suspect that Tim isn’t too bummed out, I forgot to send BOTH of you flowers on Valentine’s Day, LOL. Hey Tim, chime in, we can have some fun with the subject(s)!
Posted by Tim Jensen on March 06, 2002 at 16:11:46:
GL,
I am disgusted that you would try and insinuate that because I put up bandit signs on some boarded up houses that I would cheat someone. SHAME ON YOU! It is shameful that you would engage in this type of character assisination. I do not plan to waste anymore time on someone like you.
Do me a favor, please do not respond to my posts anymore.
Second, wish you were going to the convention… It’d be nice to meet you…
Third… I do believe what I say… but, that is exactly my feelings on some of your thought processes… I wonder how you can really believe what you say…
Fourth, Something being Illegal doesn’t make it shady… Same argument as with signs… I’m sure you broken the speeding laws a time or two… does that make you a crook… No…
Fifth, If what you do reflects on me… then I’d hate to live in your world… and vice versa I’m sure…
It doesnt work that way… and it doesnt matter anyway… to the extent your talking… you know how many Investors their are out there… I guess we are reflected by what that guy did… whatever it was… didnt follow it… Not on your life… I and my companies stand on their own two feet…
If you worry about what others do, then your world has got to be pretty shallow…
As far as wrecking property etc… that mentality has nothing to do with the world over… ever individual is responsible for his own acts… he may blame it on the world… but he’s responsible…
I’ve seen a number of the lose weight signs where someone has torn off both sides so the number couldn’t be seen. Personally I think the people who are doing this are causing more liter by leaving part of the sign posted. If they feel the need to interfere then they should at least take the whole sign and not leave unsightly parts of it left behind. They are no better than the person placing the signs. In fact they are worse.
So far I have been lucky in that respect. My signs just vanish completely! LOL
The one thing I have noticed is that the ones I put out on stakes are the ones to vanish quickly. The ones on utility poles seem to last for weeks to months. But the ones on stakes seem to generate more calls. Go figure!
I don’t know who keeps taking these signs so fast, but my gut feeling is that it’s realtors mostly taking them. I think it’s because of the “No Commissions/No Fees” on the signs that they see and don’t like. But that is just my feeling on it. I can’t say for sure who is really doing it. The good part is that I don’t have to worry about them laying in the gutters like John has talked about. Mine seem to completely vanish without a trace! LOL
That’s OK though because that’s less I have to worry about taking them down again! I just keep putting them up and someone else keeps helping me out by taking them down for me! Saves me time of having to go back out and remove any at the end of the weekend. LOL
I just figure it in as a cost of doing business and at only $1.55 per sign it’s worth the expense!
Most cities already do regulate signs even on your own property. Those ordinances are there to prevent ANYONE from putting up signs whether on their own property or not. Some towns don’t even allow realtor for sale signs to be placed in the seller’s yard! These ordinances aren’t just for people randomly placing signs around town. You can’t even do it on your own property. Government has already interferred with your rights on this one.
Posted by Tim Jensen on March 06, 2002 at 19:03:03:
John,
I would love to chime in however, I’m too busy planning my next scam. You know stealing from old ladies. John, its starts with bandit signs and next thing you know I’m robbing banks. Whenever I encounter someone who does not have rational thinking, I tend to ignore them. You know the old phrase don’t get into an argument with an idiot becuase people may not know who is who.
I think now the “nub” of the original problem was that what looked important to me and possibly to Tim’s peer group was invisible to Tim. Namely that his aggressive business and marketing style was rubbing them the wrong way. It took me a while to clue in to the fact that he couldn’t see this. He thought I was attacking him personally and answered in kind. And up we went like a rocket, only to go around and around in circles and wind up where we started.
Who is insinuating? I took pains to make it plain that I was not insinuating anything. I was asking a question.
You have been totally obtuse to any question of integrity throughout this discussion, as if it had nothing to do with anything. Now all of a sudden you are insulted. I guess I should be pleased that I finally got my point across and that you do consider reputation important, and that anything that reflects on your reputation makes you sore. Even if it comes from someone who doesn’t know you.
That is exactly how I feel. I’m only sorry it took an insult (unintentional) to get you to see it.
I’ve seen you and others use the following logic a number of times:
Bandit Sign = Illegal
Speeding = Illegal
Speeding = No big deal
therefore, Bandit Signs = Speeding = No big deal
Of course, murder is illegal too…hmmm.
So tell me this…if I sped down your street at 26mph (assuming it’s zoned 25mph) and stick a bandit sign in your front yard on my way by…would you care how fast I was going?
I don’t live in a world where I have to violate the property of others to put food on the table. Do you?
-Andrew
PS - We already played this game a while ago, just thought I’d jump in and have some fun.
