Restricted Indian Land and Land Trusts? - Posted by David Alexander


#1

Posted by Dirk Roach on January 07, 1999 at 17:35:53:

Hey Rob,
You know after reading my post again and realizing that I probably got a little hot headed, I would like to apologize myself. It’s
obvious to me (after rereading your post) that you in no way intended to offend anyone.
Anyhow, enough on that. I have submitted David and Your questions regarding this scenario to several different people whom
I know In my tribal government.
I will be happy to post whatever insights and or ideas they have, when I receive it.
Thanks and happy investing to us all,
Dirk


#2

Restricted Indian Land and Land Trusts? - Posted by David Alexander

Posted by David Alexander on January 06, 1999 at 11:50:05:

Can Restricted Land(definition below) be deeded into a Land Trust without removing the restricted status. Anyone Know?

If someone has a will setup to distribute property upon death, Can they sale the land before the die and then the will I assume would be null and void since the land is already sold?

Can you Gift a land Trust to someone? Or would you just change and make the gift the beneficial interest of the land trust.

Definition:
When the American Indians were given land by the
government, the land was given to them with the rights that
as long the land stayed Indian land, there would be no taxes paid and the state government has no jurisdiction on the land.

Thanks for any Input,

David Alexander


#3

Re: Restricted Indian Land and Land Trusts? - Posted by Dirk Roach

Posted by Dirk Roach on January 06, 1999 at 22:19:07:

The majority of Tribal Business is handled specifically by the tribe. However on bigger serious issues the Department of the Interior’s Bureau of Indian Affairs steps in. You can find out the Bureau’s general mission and what not online at:
http://www.doi.gov/bureau-indian-affairs.html

Traditionally Tribal Government is somewhat skeptical of non Indian groups or individuals in regards to business ventures and pursuits on tribal land (For good reason).
In my tribe we have oil producing land. Some of this land is LEASED off. However, it is a very complicated process and let’s just say that my tribe is very careful to cover their backsides.
I imagine this is the case involving other tribes (each are different and have limited Sovereignty).
You most likely will have to get (in writing) approval for your plans. This may even involve Indian Court. Not to be confused with a state court or even a federal court.

Things to think about,
Dirk Roach


#4

Re: Restricted Indian Land and Land Trusts? - Posted by Rob FL

Posted by Rob FL on January 06, 1999 at 19:32:43:

How is it titled now? A trust with the seller as the beneficiary shouldn’t really be considered a change in equitable ownership just legal ownership.


#5

Re: Restricted Indian Land and Land Trusts? - Posted by David Alexander

Posted by David Alexander on January 06, 1999 at 19:56:10:

Currently titled in sellers personal name. I want the
land to stay restricted Indian land.

Don’t know where to look to find out?

David Alexander


#6

Re: Restricted Indian Land and Land Trusts? - Posted by Rob FL

Posted by Rob FL on January 06, 1999 at 22:01:23:

More than likely this restriction is unconstitutional. The deed was probably recorded prior to 1968. After the Martin Luther King era, federal judges for some reason started realizing that way back in 1866 there was a 14th Amendment to the U.S. Constitution which prohibits racial discrimination. On top of that there is the Civil Rights Act of 1968 which covers religion,sex,color,etc. In other words if the government said we are going to treat you differently under the law because of the color of your skin be it red, white, or black they are in violation of the US constitution.

But the simpler route to say is deed it to the trust and keep the seller as the beneficiary. He still has the beneficial interest so he still owns (actually controls) the property.

Best wishes.


#7

Re: Restricted Indian Land and Land Trusts? - Posted by Rob FL

Posted by Rob FL on January 07, 1999 at 11:36:28:

Sorry didn’t mean to offend anyone by my statements. They were intended as a benefit. I search titles all day long but never indian reservations. I just know that in general that any discrimination by race is considered illegal and therefore unenforceable (this may not be true on indian reservations if they are indeed separately governed, again not intended to be demeaning in any way), even though in the past it was done all the time (embarrassing for me to say since my wife is hispanic). I still would think that a grantor-type revocable trust with the seller as beneficiary would just be an estate planning device and not an actual transfer of equitable ownership.


#8

How Bout’ the 1700’s - Posted by David Alexander

Posted by David Alexander on January 07, 1999 at 01:23:16:

Rob,

Sorry, you hit a nerve with that last statement but this land was given to us and restricted long before
the constitution. Yes, I am American Indian Also, (Chickasaw) It is very important to me to be able to have land passed on to me and my children and Heirs
with it’s Restricted Status. My Tribe personally was made to move off there lands in Tennessee to go Oklahoma and the land was traded. I do not believe anyone owes me anything because of my race, but if I can keep the land intact I feel it’s important. It’s a Good Solid Business Decision.

Dirk, thanks for the solid input

David Alexander


#9

Re: Restricted Indian Land and Land Trusts? - Posted by Dirk Roach

Posted by Dirk Roach on January 06, 1999 at 22:43:39:

Rob,
I hate to disagree with you but you are making the mistake of applying U.S. Constitutional Law to a Sovereign nation.
Indian Reservations are separate from state and most federal issues.
The anti-discrimtory acts of the late sixties DO NOT give way (or right) to people to go into Sovereign Indian Reservations and take advantage of Nations which have already been taken advantage far too much in our countries history.
Okay I’ll come down off my soap-box now. It just gets my blood going when I see people trying to angle their way into Indian held land.
I’m sure that this is because I personally am Native American. My Grandfather served on the Cherokee Tribal Chief Council for over 30 years. Thus I grew up with a firsthand understanding of tribal issues and concerns.
Too Many reservations are a disgrace and a black mark on our country. True today Many Tribes have had to embrace Casinos and Gambling in a last ditch attempt for survival, but still many Tribes to this day are impoverished and struggling.
I have also heard many investors complain about how it is unfair that many Tribes have in essence closed their doors to the general population in regards to real estate and other business ventures.
But really if you know and follow the history of relations between the general population and the tribes, one can understand why.
Again sorry to get on war path, this is just a topic, which I feel strongly about,

Dirk