Mortgage Elimination - Posted by Mike

Posted by Keith on September 05, 2003 at 18:03:43:

If the bank loans you their own depositors money, why do they sell or deposit the note?

The last time you refinanced, did you get your cancelled note back?

Why is all money created LOANed from a central bank at an interest rate?

When President Lincoln needed $450 million for the civil war, why didn’t he get a loan from a bank at 30% interest? Obviously he was a very low IQ, uneducated, very very stupid person, perhaps a true moron because he didn’t want the citizens to pay $150 million a year in interest?

Mortgage Elimination - Posted by Mike

Posted by Mike on September 05, 2003 at 10:21:58:

A co-worker of mine was talking to me about a program which he says can eliminate my mortgage. It is a company that says that it can cancel a mortgage because…the bank deposits your promissary note as an asset to the federal reserve or something and that you are never really loaned any money, it is just exchanged. I am sorry…I don’t know all the details…but has anyone heard of this?

I am very sceptical…and feel that even if it worked…would limit your ability to get another mortgage. The website to visit is


Re: Mortgage Elimination - Posted by Jack

Posted by Jack on September 05, 2003 at 22:54:22:

Mortgage Elimination programs are not even credible enough to qualify for the Art Bell Show (yes I know Art Bell is retired).
ps: The Federal Reserve is not a private corporation anymore than NASA or the Post Office. I seriously think these people are confusing the Federal Reserve with FNMA (Federal National Mortgage Association) or FreddieMac, which are private stock issuing corporations.

Re: Mortgage Elimination - Posted by Rob FL

Posted by Rob FL on September 05, 2003 at 19:24:47:

If these guys are for real, I wonder if they can provide written proof that they have successfully eliminated mortgages and tried their cases in court. I doubt it. Sounds like a credit repair or similar type scam.

Re: Mortgage Elimination - Posted by To Ron STARR

Posted by To Ron STARR on September 05, 2003 at 19:00:32:

Ron…i think its time to ignor and let the websters make it dissappear…

Actually, i think this is great…with idiots like this out there as competion…WE are going to continue to make money…and best yet…you and i will be fighting over who gets to buy their foreclosed home from the bank…

God isnt’America Great!!!

Re: Mortgage Elimination - Posted by Brent_IL

Posted by Brent_IL on September 05, 2003 at 17:34:11:


You may be right about the banking thing, bur I haven’t really checked it out. I believe that the reason the income tax laws are written the way they are and the reason a 1040 is a contract for self-assessment is because the whole set-up is illegal. I have met individuals who do not pay taxes based on the argument, unobtrusively made, that the income taxes don’t apply to citizens of the 50 states. These facts and a quarter will get me a quarter.

If you do what you plan, you will lose your house in foreclosure. Whether if would be legal or if it is illegal is moot. The powers-that-be will not allow this to happen.

Re: Mortgage Elimination - Posted by Ronald * Starr(in No CA)

Posted by Ronald * Starr(in No CA) on September 05, 2003 at 11:58:16:


I encourage your skepticism. This makes no sense at all. I’m sure it is totally bogus, nonsense.

That talk about federal reserve and so on is the same sort of sillyness that the tax protestors spout. And they keep getting huge fines and, I believe, even going to jail. Just read last week in the NY Times about the IRS cracking down on phony schemes to defraud them.

Sure, it would be nice if you did not have to pay the IRS. Not pay them? BOGUS!

Sure, it would be nice to eliminate your debt without paying it off. BOGUS!

Only weak-minded people are going to fall for this guff.

We had a discussion on Monday or Tuesday this week about it with an explanation of some circumstantce where one might think one could eliminate a loan because the loan was transferred to another bank and the proper paperwork was not put into the county records. My conclusion: even that makes no sense. All the lenders have to do is file the proper paperwork when they realize the error.

Lenders are not going to roll over and play dead when goofs stop paying on their $50K, $150K, or $450K mortgages. Or ask the lender to wipe it off.

It amazes me sometimes what people will believe. There is an incredible pool of ignorance and creduality in the human gene pool.

Good InvestingRon Starr*****

Make these nutcase’s disappear - Posted by B

Posted by B on September 05, 2003 at 19:34:12:

It’s amazing how one or two lunatics can muck up a good board for conversation. Their trash makes me laugh and reminds me of those funny groups who claim everything in the world is illegal and a conspiracy. Those are the same people who my uncle (the attorney General of one of our fine states) puts in jail every year. Keep up your ridiculous game. Soon enough, the conspiritors (gov.) will catch up with you. Too bad no one will be sad to see you go.

Re: Mortgage Elimination - Posted by ken

Posted by ken on September 06, 2003 at 20:40:06:

What is so hard to understand. The bank loans you money,you make payments,the bank sells this obligationso you pay someone else. why would you get something from the bank,it really has nothing to do with you except you are the payor and you mail your check somewhere else.This is so basicmy 15 year old understands

Re: Mortgage Elimination - Posted by Me

Posted by Me on September 05, 2003 at 17:38:32:

That is why you foreclose on the bank. You LOANed the bank money in the form of a promissory note. If they were LOANing their own money, why do they sell the note?

Don’t they owe you the proceeds from the sale of the note?

More on The Fed’s Mirage - Posted by dilbert

Posted by dilbert on September 05, 2003 at 18:38:05:

Sorry - my original post somehow appeared above this post. Must have been a glitch - or could it be the Feds??

Actually, the Fed creates money - and when you
have a mortgage, you are ownd this money! That’s right!

Call your friendly banker on Monday, and he will confirm this! Let’s say you owe $ 200K on a mortgage…

OK - the Fed (those Martians again…) created that money out of thin air, so you really don’t owe anything. In fact, according to the 2nd Law of Thermodynamics - you are now owed 200,000, plus interest! That’s right - for every action - there
is an equal an opposite reaction - as our friend Newton found out when the apple hit him in the head in the 16th centry - but I digress!

Tell your banker that you demand that he deposit the 200K to your account within the next 72 hours - or you will deed your property to the homeless! That will shake him up!

Try it and see what happens.

Remember, the federal tax law was never passed in 1913, the Fed only creates fiat money - and you are a citizen of the United States of America - so you have certain rights! Among these are the right to sound money. Barring this you are deprived.

Ergo - the bank owes you money!

Try it and see.


The Fed is a mirage - - Posted by dilbert

Posted by dilbert on September 05, 2003 at 18:19:13:

That’s right - the Fed is a mirage! They are
owned by little green men who eat pea soup! Now,
instead of mailing in next month’s mortgage payment,
try telling that to your banker!

Dilbert the Wise

Re: Mortgages are fraud with intent - Posted by me

Posted by me on September 05, 2003 at 17:06:04:

People that think the bank “loan” agreement is NOT fraud either haven’t researched it, or benefit from the fraud (i.e. buying foreclosures).

The promissory note is converted into a draft, without your consent. This is securites fraud.

When was the last cancelled promissory note you received? If you refinanced or paid off you SHOULD get one.

If you can ever get a cancelled note out of a bank you will see evidence of the fraud in the form of the endorsement.

How It Works… - Posted by MNChicago

Posted by MNChicago on September 05, 2003 at 15:39:03:

Banks, contrary to popular belief, do not actually
lend money. They create it out of air.

The Federal Reserve is a private company, nothing more.

When you go to a bank for a loan, you provide a
promissory note. The bank endorses it on the back and
deposits the note into an account and shows it as an

It then lists an equal amount as a liability because
they are going to loan that amount out Use a $100,000
mortgage as an example.

The bank creates an asset of $100,000 based upon the
signed promissory note. Think of a “T” acount.

It creates a liability of an equal amount, and charges
10%, for example. The bank will be repaid $100,000
plus $10,000 in interest, for purposes of illustration.
This is the liability side of the “T” account.

Banks earn their money from INTEREST.

As the loan is paid off, the payments received are
credited on the asset side to offest the liability
side, and provide the bank’s profit of interest.

One of a few pertinent questions to ask is, once the
bank is repaid the $110,000, who keeps the asset they
raised on their books? It’s still there, if you used
the “T” accounting.

With the Fed’s fractional reserve system, that asset
raised from one’s promisory note is loaned out up to
$900,000. So that additional asset they raised by
using the promissory note also expanded their loaning
cpacity rather dramatically.

Another pertinent question to ask the bank is, where in
the contract does it say the bank will raise an asset
using your signature to loan you back your own money?

Where in the signed contract…oh, the bank never
signs any contract…does it say the bank can withhold
this material informntion?

What considration does the bank provide on their part?

This is called transaction accounting, or checkbook
accounting. The Federal Reserve spells it out in
one of their publications, Modern Money Mechanics,
surprisingly no longer available…(except on the

Is what the bank does legal? Ask them to cite a single
statute that permits them to loan their own credit or
print money. Of course, one would have to be in court
to get them to even entertain the question, but the
Constitution and statutes do not support their practice.

Our money system is issued and controlled by a private
corporation, most of whose stockholders are foreigners.
Look up the Federal Reserve Bank in the phone book
under US Government. (Hint: Not there.)

You will have better luck finding them in the white
pages listed closer to Fed Ex. The Federal Reserve is
a private corporation. Most people fail to grasp the
significance of that piece of information.

Mayer Rothschild is quoted, “Let me contol a nation’s
money supply, and I care not who makes the laws.” Did
I mention the Fed is owned mostly by foreign interests?

The United States has had fiat money since 1971. Our
currency is not backed by anything. Our currency is
not even issued by the US Treasury. It is printed by
the Treasury and then sent to the Federal Reserve as
mere paper and ink. The Federal Reserve then issues
it in the form of Notes, not money.

Mr Starr, what the banks are doing is illegal, and I am
not a chest-beating patriot or a “screw the IRS and
don’t pay your taxes” type of person. By the way, the
paying of taxes is VOLUNTARY in this country, NOT
required. There are procedures that the IRS, if they
were required to follow, would legally preclude them
from collecting taxes. That is another story.

Your comment:
“There is an incredible pool of ignorance and credulty
in the human gene pool.”

You are so right, but I think for the wrong reasons.
What is being perptrated by the Federal Reserve and
the banking industry is not just illegal, it is
immoral. Unfortunately, our laws are not based on
morals, and most all of us live by morals, codes of
ehtics, etc. The Fed and banks count on it, as does
the IRS and our own government.

Go on a shopping spree at some store, and when it
comes time to pay, issue them a note in payment and see
if they will accept it. This is exactly what the
banks do. Why can they do it an we can’t?

The Federal Reserve can cite you statutes that justify
their existence (as a private corporation). State
banks can justify, by statute, their existence.
Neither can justify, by statute, issing money, and it
is illegal for any bank to lend its credit. Read any
bank’s charter. Do you know what ulta vires is?

Can mortgages be eliminated? Yes, under certain
circumstances, and quite legally. Knowledge can be
very powerful.

There are much bigger issues at stake than beating a
bank at its own game. Few people in the government
are not even aware of how our monetary system works.
Secrecy is an insidious means for doing harm. The
Fedreal Reserve is built upon secrecy, but do not take
my word for it. As you so often warn others about
learning the foreclosure business before they get into
it (i.e. do your homework), all this information can
be gleaned through research, so you can draw your own

There is much more I could expound on. Am I calling
for people to not pay thier mortgages and destroy the
banking system…the same with the IRS?


But how about requiring honesty?

Look. The Federal Reserve (foreign controlled) lends
money by issuing credit. Cost to them: paper and ink.
They charge INTEREST for that “money” loaned.

How much debt of our nation’s economy is now devoted
to just paying for the INTEREST on our debt, and by
now, you should know to whom that interest is owed?

What do you think would happen if we stopped letting
the federal reserve issue fiat money and charge us
interest for the privilege of doing so, and instead
had the US Treasury issue the same amount of fiat
moeny? The Treasury would not have to charge any
interest to themselves now, would they? We would
elininate one of the largest portions of our debt

Do you think for one moment the powers who control the
fedreal reserve would ever dare let this country retake
control of its own currency? (Remember Rothschild’s

Wouldn’t that be a tremendous savings to our government
and the rest of us being saddled with this onerous
debt that is exponentially consuming us?

One more quick leson on the federal reserve. It was
created in 1913 Since then, the value of the dollar
is worth 6 cents. Why? Inflation. What causes
inflation? Issuing fiat money. Infaltion is one of
the worst hidden taxes on any populace…a devaluation
of their own currency.

Did you know the Fed has written into law that in the
event of any bank failures, the US Government will bail
them out? Do you know of any other private
corporation that has the govenment protecting them against
their own created failure?

It is in the fed’s interest to keep issuing money
because they charge INTEREST on every single Note they
create and issue.

I will suggest to you, Mr Starr, your personal morals
and ethics would not allow you to conduct your business
the way the Fed and banks conduct theirs. And when you
point the finger of credulty, remember, three fingers
are pointing back in your direction.

I would applaud anyone who elimintes their mortgage
and beats the banks at their own dirty game, but that
is not a solution.

For me, the solution is in having an honest system
under which we could all abide. The solution is in
educating people to what is wrong so it can be fixed.

The reason why I answered you is to help spread some
"education," and asking from our government the same
standards most of us labor under. The privately-owned
federal reserve is killing us.

Democracy is buckling under the strain.


Re: Make these nutcase’s disappear - Posted by Jasonrei

Posted by Jasonrei on September 06, 2003 at 10:56:31:

I wouldn’t brag about having an uncle who is a government employee, much less an attorney general. And there are no “fine States”.

I think B is an agent of a foreign conspiracy - Posted by Franklin

Posted by Franklin on September 06, 2003 at 24:14:22:

Re: Mortgage Elimination - Posted by Ive got a bridge for sale

Posted by Ive got a bridge for sale on September 05, 2003 at 18:52:00:

I’ve Got An Idea…why don’t you use this service get your mortgage eliminated…hold your breath about 9months…and come back here posting the results of this excellant program…

if you don’t want to wait that long…no prob…send me 295.00 i’ll send you info on this great bridge for sale (great potential…you could set up a toll booth) and if your interested…i’ll sell it to you…:slight_smile:

Re: Mortgage Elimination - Posted by Roger Throckmorton

Posted by Roger Throckmorton on September 05, 2003 at 18:39:56:

When you buy a house, you buy it from the seller, generally getting a loan from a bank. The bank pays the money to the seller. You owe the bank the money they paid the seller, a promissary note is created, saying you promise to pay the money. To secure the amount you owe the bank, a mortgage is put on the property. Now you owe the bank X dollars. (YOU have NOT loaned the bank money). Since they don’t want to wait 30 years to get their money back plus interest, they sell the note. Upon selling the note they recoup their investment, that is, the money they paid the sellers when you bought the house, that you promised to pay. They have loaned you the money. Why would you ever think that they owe you money for selling the note? It is not that complicated.


I don’t know. I’ve done no research. - NTXT - Posted by Brent_IL

Posted by Brent_IL on September 05, 2003 at 18:14:41:


Re: More on The Fed’s Mirage - Posted by Bandman

Posted by Bandman on September 05, 2003 at 21:18:24:

What on god’s green earth are you smoking and where can I get some?